[Music]
hey everybody i want to welcome you to
this special edition of real life talk
our podcasting
outreach that we uh we host but we don't
host enough with all that's going on in
the world man we need to get back at
this more and more
but um i have to tell you that
uh we have today a program that in many
ways
is very raw and i have to tell you how
and why
uh this podcast today came about because
not too long ago after a church service
i met
grace cho in the foyer
and i had
asked her a few questions and she had
made a few statements
about her
uh love for god's word how that's not
always been the case and her walk with
jesus and sometimes not
and
the very experience of her life and when
i heard in just a capsulated form
what she was sharing with me i
immediately
told her would you be willing to go on a
podcast
and so she said yes and so we're here
today and nothing is scripted this is as
raw as raw can be
and so you're going to be joining me
in learning about how
this young woman
with her experience has come to this
point and place in time
and the reason why i think this is
important is because
what i know a little bit of what i know
about grace's life is a snapshot
of today's young people
and it's quite remarkable so grace i
want to welcome you thank you to real
life talk and i don't want you to be
nervous at all in any way i want you to
forget about the people that are around
us
because i was so touched by just a few
words that you shared with me um it blew
me away and i know this almost sounds
kind of cold and i don't mean it to be
but when i heard you talk
and share what you did in that moment i
just thought this is the poster child of
hope
right this is the face that i would want
to see on the milk carton
to announce
that
there
is an alternative way of thinking for
the younger generation so
um
take us uh to your life tell us your
story from the beginning
what have you experienced and then we'll
talk more about where you're at today
okay
um so
10 years ago um i
turned to the lord and i accepted jesus
christ but that was my senior year of
college
and at that point i was already liberal
leaning
and then
for the last 10 years that i've been out
of college i
became completely indoctrinated by
the left-wing um way of thinking by from
like the media and social media
progressively
um
and
so that went on for a few years
where
i called myself a christian except that
i had it all wrong so it was this is my
way like
this is my truth and
i'm going to insert god into the
equation the way that it fits for me and
my truth you know like completely wrong
um so
so that goes on for several years
um i'm living in san francisco at that
point and a year and a half ago i moved
down from san francisco to chino hills
uh shortly thereafter i find this church
and start attending
and there were several times in the
course of last year where i walked out
of here
like in my mind i thought i was storming
out but i was trying to keep a call so
you're one of the many who get up and
walk out when when i start speaking
sometimes no no i never walked down in
the middle i always stayed until the end
okay but i walked out being like how can
they talk about politics like that in
church how can the pastor say that i'm
never coming back
but then it's not even several weeks in
between like the next sunday i would
find myself just driving back and and i
couldn't understand it i was just like
what's going on and now i know it was
totally the holy spirit um and so i do
want to say thank you for teaching god's
word and his truth the way that you do
um
but every single week the holy spirit
just kept bringing me back and i hadn't
missed a single sunday since
i started attending
um the real turning point was
late june
so
um sorry i'm a little shaky because i've
never done it no this is great you're
doing great
so um you know we had all
um we had the black lives matter
protests happening and it was everything
felt so dark and there was just so much
chaos and confusion and
um
you know like i would start seeing on
social media like just people attacking
each other like you know if you didn't
say something you were attacked and then
when you did say something you were
attacked for saying it wrong
and so everyone's like you know full of
emotion and we're trying to process
what's going on
and
um i started like i really really wanted
to do something and so i was like
looking to other people for inspiration
just like was not getting it something
seemed like
i just
couldn't get things right so
god placed this in my heart where like i
had this that desire to look to him i
you know and i decided like god is the
one and only truth like i need to turn
to him and
you know
find the truth coming from him
so i decided for
um like a couple weeks however long it
would take um
that i would cut myself off from all
social media and i put down all the
books that people were saying like oh
you should read to fight racism like all
the books like netflix social media
everything i cut it off and then instead
i decided to turn my focus to god and um
like
so i turned to prayer and worship and
his word and the bible says in luke 11
to
ask and and you'll receive and seek and
you'll find and knock in the door will
be open to you in regards to the holy
spirit so i just kept praying
for god to enlighten me with his holy
spirit and to you know to show me
like the way yeah which is his way and
oh my gosh within like a month's time
there was a complete 180 in my life and
so as of that whole process started on
june 23rd um i've been sort of like
journaling this process
and so as of june 23rd i said um that i
was ashamed of being an american
i had bought into
all the deception from the media about
blmb organization
and then
as of that point even though my heart
had already started to turn i was still
pro-abortion
and in a month's time
all of that changed
and then
not just that but
god completely took away all the anxiety
in my life and it's just like not it's
not just regular anxiety that i
just described moments ago this was
like major like i would even say
debilitating anxiety that i had suffered
from for 10 years
and it's something that i came to just
accept about myself it you know like
once
this anxious thought came in that was it
like forget about me getting any work
done for the rest of the day or feeling
like i could be out in a social setting
and
for anyone out there who struggles with
anxiety and anxiety anxiety attacks
they'll know just like how burdened you
are with like not just the
anxiety attack episodes but always
wondering like when is the next one
going to come up you know
and
god completely took it away without like
any
medication since i started this process
i haven't had any anxiety attacks and in
its place god has filled me with like
this peace and discomfort and this joy
that i have never felt before
um
and i'm not saying that i don't get
anxious thoughts i still do but then
right when they do i turn my attention
immediately to the lord and to praise
and worship and within like minutes it
all falls away
um and if i may just add one more thing
of course so um
so i mentioned that i was previously
like pro-abortion and
um
over the course of the first i think two
weeks or so um my heart started to
slowly change but there was this one
particular day where god put a deep deep
deep convict conviction in my heart that
made me realize just how wrong i was and
um
i'll tell you
that i just broke down crying it was i
had like
tears and snot just like pouring down my
face i
you know my body was just sort of like
rocking back and forth just like just so
grieved by how wrong i was
um oh gosh
um that's awesome and
um
what happened next was that i had this
health issue
and interestingly enough it was a
women's health issue
i've had it for eight years
and
i stopped seeing
any
doctor about it because after i sought
out the opinions of four different
doctors and they all told me they
couldn't do anything i was just like
okay like i guess that's it
um and he completely he healed me of
that yeah
a hundred percent so
god is real he is
still working miracles yes he's so good
and faithful and loving and
merciful
just like just thinking back on
how i had it so so wrong for 10 years
but he like
he never gave up on me he never stopped
loving me he waited and waited and then
finally once i decided to
turn to him he like completely welcomed
me with with open arms
exactly so i want to ask you this
question let's go back let's go back to
your upbringing your childhood the
location of that the
the atmosphere of your home uh reason
why i'm asking is because
uh good bad or ugly the home that we are
brought up in has a profound influence
upon us developing a worldview that is
how we see the world through the lens of
our process so tell us a little bit
about that uh your upbringing
uh sure so my dad um was a minister
actually so we grew up in the church um
and
it was just something that my
self softened my sister and my brother
we accepted um there was like no
questions asked like
it was a given that we had to
you know
follow god and liberalize this
yeah
yeah it was just like passed down to us
um and then when i went off to college i
decided
um that you know i wanted to try a
living life on my own and where was that
so you're at what age and you are aware
at this time
um so this was going into
um
freshman year at harvard
and so i was 18 then yeah
were you living did you move from san
francisco area to boston or
no we were living in new york at that
time so you were living okay we grew up
in new york okay and so going into
college i
made it this conscious decision that you
know i wanted to try living life on my
own and um this this is the first time i
wasn't like living under my parents room
yeah
my parents roof where um
all this freedom yeah yeah
um and it's so funny because you would
think that me hanging on to like my
freedom would make me feel free um but i
had never felt more like burdened in my
life
um
and
just where i am today having surrendered
everything to god
i have never felt more free in my life
but going back to um
my i guess my upbringing um was
yeah just so you you have can i let me
be kind of blunt it may not be this
this way exactly but
so you're in a christian home
and it is embedded in you that this is
what we believe this is how it is
and then you are released um into what
people would say is the real world
which i have debates about if that's the
real world but you go to harvard
and um i would imagine as it is today
harvard extremely liberal very
progressive
and so you are baptized in this entirely
different world view
and um
sad to say much of that world view on
the university college campus is a world
view with a grudge it's got a chip on
its shoulder it's kind of angry it's
bitter
it focuses on what's really wrong more
than the amazing opportunities that are
in front of you
did you at all find out at any time
whatsoever regarding harvard
uh how harvard was established why it
was established did you know who
created harvard did they ever
indoctrinate you and any of that
truth at all regarding the very origins
of your school
not really yeah yeah
um and it's funny because i was thinking
about this a lot the last few days where
during high school
um my teachers placed a lot of emphasis
on
looking out for media bias
and
um i had this one history teacher in
particular and she
like the the papers where i thought i
had a very clear argument
um that i was like proud of i'm like you
know what like i wrote this like very
very well like you know like
everything's very like
clearly laid out and those were
interestingly the papers i got the
lowest marks in and it was the papers
where i felt like i kind of didn't
really have a point but i kept going
round and round about because i was like
well like but there's this perspective
and on the other side there's this but
then this is how this side is fighting
back and so the papers where like there
didn't seem to be a focus where i
thought like okay i just like wrote that
terribly but i
had this like mindset of like
questioning everything those were like
the papers that my teachers would like
give me the highest marks in
and
and so
then i'm like thinking back to my
education at harvard and this could just
be me this might i'm not speaking for
like everyone but
um
like the
any idea of media bias i kind of just
felt like
i think
or fighting media bias
like fell away from me um
yeah i just like kind of got out of the
habit of doing that and i realized that
so you're saying if i have if i
understand you're right you're saying
that
you got the you got the understanding
that they really wanted you
to fall in line
with the
mob
thinking versus you even being open
enough
with critical thinking
to present
other views around a particular topic
whatever it was you were in other words
you were being more fair regarding the
issue or issues that you were not sure
about you introduced various options
right and they didn't like that
um yeah there were a couple of times
where
i was
i had to gather evidence and
the things that kind of didn't
fit my paper i was just like well that's
inconvenient i'm just going to take it
out and that was never an issue
and that just might have been my
experience in the courses that i
stumbled upon but if that's happened in
a couple courses that i can remember
then
yeah wow okay so now at this time you're
in boston and bring us now forward from
there what transpired in your life so i
ended up moving to san francisco and
um
i
was
really really trying to find the lord
while i was there
um wow okay hang on hang on so you're
brought up with
the biblical worldview you go to harvard
and you have all of this different
dynamic but you go to san francisco to
find the lord
or you didn't have that plan you you
went to frisco and you found out that
jesus was not only
in new york it turns out that he's in
boston and san francisco yeah he's
working on your heart
because you had a past
where the bible was put in you from the
beginning this is so critical for where
we're going oh look i'm sorry let me
backtrack just a little bit so coming
out of boston i guess um
i so after four years
of attending harvard i came to this
point where um
i was very very depressed and i
it was this very one clear moment where
i was on my bedroom floor and like that
was the
lowest of my lows and i just couldn't
find
any like little parts to pick myself up
and
things felt hopeless and all of a sudden
i felt this voice but it's it's it
wasn't a voice in my head it was sort of
like in my heart
um
and you know is god saying like i've
already forgiven you why can't you
forgive yourself and that's the moment i
mentioned it way in the beginning when i
said that i turned to jesus christ
so
it was then that
and immediately i kind of felt like
there was this very like warm comforting
hug
um
like spiritually and so
it picked me up
and i decided to start afresh and that
at that time my closest friends were in
san francisco so
um that's when i made the move across
the country to get a new fresh start
um and it was a very godless city
well i just drove through there a couple
days ago and it's still the same but
wow
and um but
i still wanted to fight for the lord and
i
i just like knew he was real in my life
and so i just i found this church and
um
i was the only one out of all my friends
going to church who believed in god and
um
i've kind of i felt
i felt silent about my faith because
every time i opened my mouth about it
um i would get backlash and so
um
i was there for four years
trying to
like fight to have a relationship with
the lord but it was
not being in the environment that was
conducive to it that was keeping me from
it so
um
yeah without
you know
a great career opportunity or anything
down here i yeah i moved down here how
did that happen um
how did that happen i mean you just
don't spin the globe and stick your
chino hills i mean so my parents had
moved down here
and so i decided i just wanted to break
away from san francisco and my parents
were here and
it just seems logical like let me just
you know like go back home and make up
for lost time with my parents that i
like didn't really have growing up
um
and so i
decided to move down here just took like
a job
that um i didn't even care for at all
but
god had a purpose in that oh yeah and he
led me to
to this church and my life has changed
wow your life
has been set apart by god and
you
you you didn't know that early on but
god has always known that because his
truth never changes so his hand's been
upon you and the fact that isaiah 55 11
tells us that his word that goes forth
does not return void so all this time
whatever you were doing wherever you
went numerous times you've already said
that you had this thought about god or
you felt really convicted or you felt
his hug
these things
are proof
tangibles
of being a child of god
in your christian experience in your
christian journey and your walk with god
what's the what for you is the one of
the most or the most difficult thing to
to be grappling with is there's
something
that you are
really hanging on to or really trying to
find out about um regarding god i mean
like maybe his nature or his plan or
is there something that there's a
question mark over your head as to
god why this or how the other
or even lord what's your will for my
life what is
grace's biggest pursuit um
dynamic right now in grace's life
um
the
all the chaos that's happening right now
across the nation and like the the
division and and hatred
i
can't wrap my head around it and i'm
just like why is this happening and
um
you know like
and i don't have the answers like i like
you know
no one does you know it's but
i just
even though i'm trying to grapple with
it i know that it's all part of god's
plan or there's just like a reason and
he's also using people
um for his purpose and um
right now that's the biggest
i guess issue in my life where i want to
be one of those people
and i don't know how
um and i
i feel that i'm not worthy of being used
by god but i pray that every morning
that somehow hey can i encourage you
none of us
are worthy to be used by god that's the
amazing thing scripture says in the book
of romans it's the goodness of god that
leads a man to repentance and
that carries with that remarkable thing
is god who am i why who what and
none of us are worthy to handle such
things so that's awesome um if you could
if you could have i i always put it this
way if you could rub a christian
lamp
and have this this perfect will be done
for your life
um psalm 37 4 says delight yourself in
the lord
and he will grant or bestow upon you the
desires of your heart it's quite a
powerful scripture because people only
hear the latter end of the verse oh my
goodness he's going to give me the
desires of my heart well there's is
there's a prerequisite it's delight
yourself in the lord
and when i hear your testimony i'm
hearing that grace is
delighting herself from the lord so
let's take that verse and you fill in
the blank let's
you can dream right now
as you walk with god and as you journey
with god you're delighting yourself in
the lord that's because grace is saying
i want i want to know what you want me
to do god and i want to know more of
your word and i want to i want to tell
people
my heart is hurt by the confusion that's
out there by the violence and by the
ugliness people need to know the answer
you're delighting yourself in him so
then what is
the desire of your heart
as grace cho grows up and lives this
life until christ returns
if you could rub a christian lamp what
would come out regarding your life
i don't know like how
all the one and only thing i'm certain
of is that um
i don't want to be silent anymore and
i just want to proclaim the truth of
christ so that
um
that god just uses me as a vessel to
bring people into his kingdom um
i don't know how that's going to happen
but that's no of course not and that's
that's part of the walk but you see look
you just articulated
you're look at this you're because
you've been pursuing god your desire
your desire that's in you
is in 100 correlation and agreement with
the word of god
you are actually proof positive that
psalm 37 4
is being active and answered in your
life because you could have said and
it's nothing wrong you could have said i
want to love god with all my heart and i
want to be
the best
artist or piano player in the world hey
that's fine god bless you
your answer was i want to tell people i
want to be used more i want to make an
impact so god grace god has a ministry
for you
plan he actually knows it he's holding
it
he's known it forever
and you're going to be discovering that
so the cool thing about it is as you
seek him he's going to open it up more
and more and it's going to be there and
again as ephesians says it's been there
from the beginning and
titus tells us also that and and
philippians that these are plans that
god has before the foundations of the
world were ever laid
for us
so um i'm absolutely blown away and
encouraged
and i know that you're back at church
and i know that we are um
meeting full bore as a church goes but
there's other ministries that we need to
bring back online that have been uh our
history and we're working on that
but you probably don't know about a
ministry that
um you might want to look into
and that ministry is entitled uh the
call that's the name of it the call and
when you hear about it you got to pray
about it you got to
find out about it because
the call ministry equips you every every
believer who takes the course equips you
on how to share
jesus the gospel
fully and and quite frankly
theologically
exact
and it empowers you it gives you
strength you may find that that's one of
the next steps for you is to find out
how can i be galvanized
with truth and to share the gospel with
someone in five minutes at an airport or
an elevator or whatever and know that i
gave the gospel the pure unadulterated
gospel and that's a ministry again
that's coming online here coming back
online but um those kinds of things as
you present yourself open to what god
wants to do
there's no telling what he's going to do
with your life i
i wish i could bottle you with what i
heard today and just dispense that in
people's lives
because your message needs to be heard
and what god's doing in your life needs
to be replicated and you're right i
agree revival is coming and you are
and you rightfully have described
revival because you have known you have
known the lord you've known of the lord
and you're experiencing a revival in
your life
revival applies only to those who are of
faith people forget this
revival
revive vive is life revive is to
bring back life
you had it you got away from it and now
you got it
the world is lost they cannot be revived
they can only be saved
but you said something so wise
and i agree
revival will awaken the church
okay the church will become so
attractive to the lost world that is
searching that the lost they have
somewhere to go
to find salvation
and you are living that you are being
that
in small
what god wants to do in mass
with with the entire church itself so
um i'm curious what would you say
to someone that is has uh has your
generation and
uh before them and has somewhat of an
experience before them what would you
say because a lot of kids today are they
they were given the gospel
they went to college
they view now mom and dad as a bunch of
clowns
and
that they didn't know what they were
doing i'm not talking about the level
and the quality of parenting i'm talking
about
kids who have heard the gospel growing
up what would you say to them right now
what what would you tell them regarding
their upbringing their family their
church their past in the gospel setting
um
i would say that
having known the lord walking away from
him created the most pain i had ever
felt in my life
even when i thought i had everything i
wanted like
you know a well-paying career like a
good relationship
just
i had what
society might have
looked at as successful yeah and even
with with all of that i felt this void
um
something that could never be filled by
anything else
um
turning to god and letting him in and
giving
giving your life up to him
um
has brought me
so much freedom
um
and a joy that nothing else in life has
been able to give me
um and so
i would say um
i would say just
jump into turning back to the lord and
um and give that a shot and god will do
the work in your life to show you that
um
that's the only way to be it's awesome
so the scripture declares that he who
has begun a good work in you
will complete it until the day of jesus
christ and so
i tell you i'm excited to see what it's
going to be
i look forward to talking to you more i
want you to make sure that you come up
to me in the foyer in the courtyard
and
i want to be watching now and i want to
as this church does we want to play a
role in
in bringing to you or letting you know
of opportunities because you have this
passion so in my mind okay my mind
i'm listening to you and i'm thinking
man i want her to meet
uh so and so this guy is a
business creator this guy
started with nothing and has all of this
now this empire he's built but then i
want her to meet a couple of uh
congresswoman we know
i want her to meet maybe the senator i'd
love for her to meet because my as you
were talking my mind is going and and
with your generation and with with your
story
one of the things is oh man i want to
introduce her to our friends at prager
university
and there's just so much because god is
on you
it is so obvious that god's hand is on
you
i'm delighted and excited to see what
that's going to look like and
we as a church
this is what we delight in we've got
young people
now all over this world that this church
from an early age has assisted them and
helped them and now
are connected with them in various
places and we want to make sure that
happens to you we don't want you to miss
out on the thing because god's got an
amazing plan for you amen so grace it
was awesome being with you god bless you
look forward to seeing more of you bless
you
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